Sasha wrote:I think the Cullens *do* cause horror and disgust in people. Maybe not us, since we see them from Bella's lovely rose-colored glasses, but what if you heard of a creature who could run fast, couldn't be killed, was rock-hard, had sharp teeth and venom, and drank human (or animal) blood? I think that does cause "horror and disgust". At least in me.
Heartsong wrote:We can not force the entirety our human values onto a vampire. They are not human even if their roots are in humanity. A zebra can not force its values on the lion who is about to make it her supper.
December wrote:We can be untroubled about killing chickens because they are not like us. We are troubled about killing other people, because they are.
We can be untroubled about killing chickens because they are not like us. We are troubled about killing other people, because they are. We identify with them; we feel it would be monstrous not to value their lives as we value our own. And vampires still are like us, in the ways that matter -- that's what makes it possible for Bella and Edward to fall in love, to be each other's soulmate. It's not just that vampires have their roots in humanity -- they still possess it. Speed, strength, longevity, even their drive to kill us for food doesn't alter that underlying truth. (We don't feel entitled to kill other people because they are crippled, likely to die before us, or stand between us and a better standard of nutrition).
December wrote:Heart Song wrote:We can not force the entirety our human values onto a vampire. They are not human even if their roots are in humanity. A zebra can not force its values on the lion who is about to make it her supper.
But then, a lion never loses its heart, hopelessly, irretrievably, to a zebra. Isn't that the point about "the lion falling in love with the lamb"? It only confirms what the Cullens instinctively sense: that humans and vampires have a shared "humanity" (for lack of a better word).
"Marcus sees relationships. He's surprised by the intensity of ours."
devadasi7 wrote:Would it be better for us to just eat meat without trying to make more humane choices? I don't think it would. It doesn't feel like a cop-out to me, it feels like making more humane choices that realtistically fit into our lifestyle. This is what I see as Edward's choice as well. It's not as good as being a vegetarian, but it's better than not worrying about being humane at all.
I'm still confused about how it can be better to kill the mother with her child than it is to kill the rapist....I don't understand the reasoning behind that at all.
LisaCullenAZ wrote:The part about Vampires still possessing their humanity is a little sketchy for me, though. I see it more like this: A Vampire can try to regain his humanity. But not retain it. They would first loose all sense of it, but it would not be impossible for them to somehow revive it. And to me, it seems more like this is the exception rather than the rule.
I don't think it's just a physiological change that occurs. I know they maintain their same personality traits, and they don't change their mentalities or emotional tendencies. But they do have a change in perception, as far as their place in the world is concerned.
Vampires DO see us like we see chickens. Their frame of mind is altered along with their bodies when they are turned.
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